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tv   Disrupt With Karen Finney  MSNBC  August 10, 2013 4:00pm-5:00pm EDT

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ask about the air optix® contacts so breathable they're approved for up to 30 nights of continuous wear. serious eye problems may occur. ask your doctor and visit airoptix.com for safety information and a free one-month trial. thanks for disrupting your saturday. the president tells congress not to be hood winked on health care -- >> my friends in the other party have made the idea of preventing these people from getting health care their holy grail. >> obamacare. >> obamacare. >> obamacare. >> behold, this is the holy grail. >> obamacare. >> obamacare. >> they used to say, well, we'll replace it with something better. >> we need to repeal and replace it. >> repeal and replace. >> there is not even a pretense now. >> it's a ploy to say where
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yours program when we're saying the free margaret, the free market, the free market. >> it is too much to bereave that republicans want 30 million people to go without health care. >> i would rather shut the government down than continue shutting america down. that's exactly what obamacare does. >> the idea that you would shut down the government unless you prevent 30 million people from getting health care is a bad idea. >> president obama heads to his vacation with a new verve, taking health care fight straight to the gop in his first former press conference since april. the president called out the unrelenling focus on denying health care to millions of americans. >> the really interesting question is, why it is that my friends in the other party have made the idea of preventing these people from getting health care their holy grail.
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their number one priority. the one unifying principal in the republican party is making sure that 30 million people don't have health care. at least they used to say, well, we'll replace it with something better. there is be even a pretense now that they'll replace it with something better. >> he continued that theme today in orlando. while republicans have been railing against the affordable care act, some even threatening to shut down the government, new polling says the ma rt jo of americans do not want congress to repeal obamacare and even the majority of republican leaning voters are tired of incumbents who want to delay or defund obamacare. that defunding would take health care away from people with preexisting conditions which for women can include treatment for domestic violence or rape. would it take away money from seniors who save $6.1 billion on prescription drugs since 2010. and forget about those rebates which totaled more than $1
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billion that consumers got from their insurance companies last year. joining me to discuss this new strategy, strategist from the central for american progress and pollster, thank you to you both for joining us. >> thank you for having me. >> i want to start with you. i thought the president was fantastic yesterday on this issue of health care and it was great to see him sort of taking the fight right back to the republicans. some are saying, why was not he this direct before now? >> i think that there are a lot of people who are criticizing the fact they feel he should have been stronger earlier. i think that this administration has been out there fighting the health care go fight for a while. and i think they timed it for perfectly, right before congress goes home. right before the summer doldrums set in. a nice slow friday. i think it was an effective use of the bully pulpit yesterday. >> the president also pointed out that the gop has dropped that repeal and replace talk
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with straight out repeal. i'm wondering if you think that's why we're seeing a bit of a shift in the numbers. >> yeah. i think it is. and you know, the public has been against that from the get-go. >> let's fix it. if there is a part that's not working, let's make it better. the number one role that they want is to help real people and small businesses to figure out if they can be helped by obamacare, whether they can sign up or not. this is a real shift in their focus. they're talking about discouraging people from signing up. that is immoral in my opinion. then on the other hand you would shut down the government. destroy the credit rating. ryan the economy of the greatest and biggest country in the world for a political fight. i think that president obama
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honestly has been focused on implementing. i think he thought these two extremes were inconceivable. and now it is their holy grail and that's all they're talking about. >> it strikes me that what the president did, it is not just talking about denying people. there is a shift. we're talking about taking something away from people and what i've seen suggests, wait a second. that's not what we want. >> my own small business. we got a rebate last year. we got a notice to send to all of our female and male employees that birth control is now prevented coverage and it should be covered without a co-pay. that's real services that i saw firsthand in my own small business. and the republicans want to take that away and offer me absolutely nothing? >> right. >> and they say free market, free market. the free market hasn't worked. the insurance companies have been gouging us for decades. >> and people know it. >> you know, the president continued his message through a group of disabled veterans in
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orlando today. let's take a listen. >> some folks are out there trying to scare people including veterans. so let me say this as plainly as i can. if you already have health insurance, or health care from the v.a., you done have to do a thing yufrl v.a. coverage does not change. it is safe. there are no new fees. don't let them -- hoodwink you. >> i love that. again, we see him calling out this sort of scare tactics. and then we saw the president call out the republicans for threatening to shut down the government. as she was just saying, unless obamacare is defunded. let's take a listen to that. >> the idea that you would shut down the government unless you prevent 30 million people from getting health care is a bad idea.
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what you should be thinking about is how can we advance and improve ways for middle class families to have some security so that if they work hard, they can get ahead and their kids can get ahead will. >> you know, it strikes me that again this tone from the president, this message seems to be very quickly. eric cantor was quickly on defense saying nobody is advocating for a government shutdown. but at the same time, we have some sound that i'm not going to play. they have been add indicating for a shutdown. that has been their message for the last couple weeks. >> right. i don't know who eric canner is listening to or talking to. but absolutely the republican party has been saying shut it down to fun obamacare. there are some democrats fighting against that but this is a monster that you created. if you run around and you keep saying that all you want to do is shut down obamacare and shut down obamacare, then the next
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logical step is people will say then shut down the government. if that's what you want to do, then let's take it tots farthest extreme of so it is a very interesting dynamic that's happening in the republican party right now. for me, i happen to love watching it. you know, people's lives are at stake. >> what's interesting about the two is it seem to be my colleague, steve kornacki has pointed out almost a litmus test in material of whether or not they'll shut down the government. we saw this week, gop members of congress were kind of getting it from both sides at town halls. but you know, the thing that i feel like we should remind people is that the gop handbook for this recess said to engage constituents of all backgrounds on the negative effects of obamacare and the house republican planned to dismantle it. so you know, when i see people in, let's be honest. most members of congress when they do these events, they're talking to people.
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they pretty much know who is in that audience and what they're going to say. >> sometime people can infiltrate it. and the polling indicates where the public is at. the public wants to move from this from a political fight to a consumer issue and that is particularly true for women voters. and 80% of the health care decision makers in this country are women. they're the ones who tell the men in their lives when it come to health care and the men admit it. and 80% of the health care voters are women. so women want to move and say what does this do for our family? i don't want another fight. and women who believe in a role for government for sure don't want to shut down government. so you want to talk about a war on women. this is a war on women. and i think they're going to lose massively at the voting booth if they keep this up. >> this is an important point that she makes. women are make have the economic decisions in their household. i would imagine that it would be women who will, if they have
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children in college or in their early 20s, make them sign up. i know if i were, that would be my mother's role in my life. again, you know, women are the most savvy, i think, in this, in material of what we stand to lose. we've gained preventive services with more to come. the affordable care act ends the gender ratings which generally means we pay more. it provides maternity services. coverage to all those who don't have it but need it. not to mention preexisting conditions which people don't realize, thing like breast cancer or domestic violence counseling. i once said having a uterus should not be a preexisting condition. is that really a message the gop thinks it will win with women? >> apparently they do. you look at people like ken cuccinelli and the thing that he is advocating for in virginia. it seem like they really haven't learned the lesson of 2012. they still seem to think it is more important to rile up their base than to appeal to the
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majority of americans out there. and the majority of women who want obamacare to come through. the reason why they are completely freaking out about obamacare is because once people have health care, once january 1st rolls around, they'll be taking away something from millions and millions of people. and so that's why you see this fury happening right now. >> and once again, it will be up to the women to make sure that doesn't happen. two of my favorite women. thanks to you both. next, the nsa leaks has americans asking questions about spying and the role of big brother. for you b found millions of americans it is every day. alert.
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a general impression has taken hold not only among the
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american public but also around the world that somehow we're out there willy-nilly just sucking in information on everybody. and doing what we please with it. that's not the case. >> so in this press conference yesterday, president obama addressed concerns over the government's ability to monitor communications and track our activities online and on the phone. fears about domestic spying and surveillance have been running high since classified information about the nsa's program first leaked with outrage from both the left and the right what about the came intrusions we're not talking about? what about the spanish mom who cannot run out without her i.d. in case she's stopped. what about the cuban american who cannot go to a baseball game without eyes on him every second and what about black teenage here's know they'll be questioned by police. activist tim wise wrote this about the nsa leaks.
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>> those who were especially chapped about the program, about the very concept of their government, keeping tabs on them, in effect profiling them as potential criminals, as terrorists, are almost entirely those for whom stuff like this is new. people who have never before been presumed criminal, up to no good or worthy of suspicion. in short, they are mostly white and heal and middle class or above. and most assuredly, not muslim. at the heart of this debate is a deeper conversation about trust and our fears of government intrusion. joining me now, msnbc contributor james peterson. and thank you so much, james, for joining me. you actually got me thinking about this yesterday. in a comment that you made in response to the president's press conference. you talked about it as a privileged conversation. can you expand on that. >> sure. people have been telling me to
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read the fourth amendment and i don't care about civil liberties. what we need to do is have a more comprehensive conversation. the reason the conversation has been privileged up to this point is because of exactly what tim wise pointed out. the people most joust raged by this are people who generally speaking, have the privilege to go through their everyday life without the kind of immediate and what i refer to as physical surveillance that black and brown youth have to risk getting frisked. i want to expand the kofrlgs to think about that kind of surveillance that directly affects those folk who are a little less, have less voice in the conversation. >> i think that's such an important point. i want to be clear when we're talking about the nsa, snowden and those issues, particularly when we're talking about it in the context of keeping america safe and terrorism. this conversation in no way, shape or form takes away from
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the level of importance of that. but what i thought was interesting, and i think tim makes this point. i think you made this point. there is an entry point in here when we're talking about being afraid of our government. that i felt like there is an entry point for people to say, it is not just stop and frisk. there are so many ways we're being profiled and surveiled. one thing is housing where there is evidence of significant bias against african-americans. >> that's right. there are so many examples. look at the disparities in traffic stops. look at the disparities in arrests for marijuana possession. look at the disparities for disciplinary action against students of color in the public school system. when we're thinking about the sort of broad concept of people living in fear and being surveiled and intimidated by their government. my point is that we need to have
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had this conversation along time ago. when they started putting cameras in street lights and traffic lights to surveil urban areas, they started to ramp up and become this really aggressive criminal justice system. the war on drugs is a part of that but also the racial bias and class bias that exists in that system. we need to apply the energy from this conversation around the nsa to the very real lived experiences of people of color and poor folk and women in our society. >> actually to that point, our colleague melissa harris perry had an interesting story about this when she was talking about going through tsa screening in kentucky and how the tsa person got all up in her braids to make sure there was not anything in there. making the point, you go through this, what is it? $7,000 machine. that basically shows everything and you still have to go scrambling through her hair. and i think it is such an important point. that we connect these dots for
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people that there is this level of intrusion. that's a physical intrusion. when we're talking about feeling intruded upon in terms of our e-mails and our phone calls, i want people to think about what it feels like to have your head intruded upon like that. >> yeah. what does it feel like to be a poorer person, someone who looks, you don't have to be arabic or muslim. someone who looks arabic or muslim. in arizona you don't have to be chicano or mexican, think about what it is to be in their shoes. to walk through this nation. to walk through public spaces and feel the limitations of surveillance. this is like direct surveillance. this is not someone reading your text messages. this is someone stopping and you asking for your papers. i want to expand the conversation to include that. i think those rights for me personally are at a premium in this discussion. >> absolutely. thank you for getting this conversation going, dr. peterson. such an important point. i think we're all mature enough
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that we can have both conversations. >> i hope so. thank you for having me. coming up, sean hannity called it a bold ultramateum and he is not talking about megan kelly taking his time spot. a lesson on hollow threats coming up. [ male announcer ] that's why there's ocuvite to help replenish key eye nutrients. ocuvite has a unique formula not found in your multivitamin to help protect your eye health. ocuvite. help protect your eye health.
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guess who needed just two weeks of therapy to heal a lifetime of sin. that's right. bob filner is out of rehab a week earlier than expected. more than a dozen women have accused him of sexual harassment but so far, the mayor refuses to resign. and his recall efforts continue. it has been california senator barbara boxer who has joined call for filner to resign. this is one where regardless of party, i want elected officials in california to follow suit and help get this man out. we've got much more ahead. but for a lighter moment from one side of the pond to another.
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a paul and a prince deliver the weather. >> the weather or something? >> if you can do the weather. >> yes. where is it from? this is in england? >> do you know the weather here in new york. >> no, no, i'll do yours instead. rainy, cloudy and gras i. so do what you can, guys. keep a stiff upper lip. >> aha. >> snow for the higher ground of the highlands. the potential for a few flurries over ballot moral. (tires screec) red hot deal days are back. (alarm beeping) stop for no one. what? it's red hot deal days. get $100 off the samsung galaxy note ii with features like pop-up play. lets you use any app while watching video. or use the s pen for hand-written notes. just $199.99. hurry in, sale ends august 11th. getting the best back to school deals. that's powerful. verizon.
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let's go. yeah! peanut butter and jelly's a stable in our house for school lunches look at walmart's price. wow! that's great. if you find a lower advertised price they'll match it at the register. really... yeah, in a "jif". that's walmart's everyday low price. seriously?! yeah! now you have everything you need for back to school. that was easy. more school for your money. guaranteed. ok, here you go. what?! that's the walmart low price guarantee backed by ad match. save time and money getting your kids ready for school. bring in receipts from your local stores and see for yourself. i cannot have company in the business of making what i consider to be promotional movies about the life of hillary clinton when at the same time we know that her people are gearing up for a presidential ride. i have to set a debate calendar that has the best interests of our party and our nominees in mind. if i've got nbc doing a mini series with diane lane starring on behalf, important traig
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hillary clinton on a four-day mini series, it makes my choice of moderators much easier. >> the republican national committee has issued a bold ultimatum for both nbc and cnn. >> reince priebus issued that so-called bold ultimatum earlier this week. here's the thing about his rage. it is full of you know what. he single two letters to the presidents of cnn and nbc entertainment calling both to cancel their plans. if they refuse to come plirk he threatens he will needs partner with the networks nor sanction any debates they sponsor. he also threatened penalties to any 2016 gop contender who decides to participate in cnn or nbc sponsored debates. >> for the first time in the history of our party, the republican national committee has rule-making authority now
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and we can tie the debate calendar. we can tie who the moderators are going to be to the nomination for president. in our rule book. we couldn't do that before. so now we can say, here is going to be the debate calendar. here is who the moderators are going to be. here are the debate partners. to the candidates, you can participate in these debates. but if you participate in debates other than the ones on the calendar, then there's going to be penalties. >> ooo, penalties. what penalties? leading up to the 2012 presidential election, we saw 27 republican primary debates. seven of which were not sanctioned by the rnc but none of the candidates who participated in them were penalized for doing so. how could they be? >> the fact is these are hollow threats by an ultimately powerless chairman. with me now is someone who knows a thing or two about that. governor dean, thank you for being with me. >> you're very welcome. it is hard to do this.
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if it were so easy, they wouldn't have had 27 debates and made themselves look like idiots in the last cycle. they don't want to do that again. you can be really tell the networks what to do. not only because it is a violation of the first amendment,ial though it doesn't seem to bother the other side here. but because you can't control your own candidates. >> of course! i mean, try to imagine what would happen. let's say for the sake of argument that rand paul decided to do x, y, z, and cheryl did not like it, he will alienate them any way. >> exactly. that was the thing, i have to tell you this week that i was sort of like outraged by that people were sort of taking him seriously when you and i both know, there is nothing a party chairman can do to stop a candidate from free air time basically. for a network debate. that isn't going to happen. >> we try to do this. we had some success. what we did was very, very
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different. also govern in the part by the budget. if you want to do a good job, it costs at least a million dollars to put on one of these debates. and frankly, the peel putting on the debates called the tune. he doesn't get to name the moderator ever. if somebody else is paying for the debate. >> as as i recall, the campaigns weigh in. you know, peel don't realize the negotiations that go on between the networks and the campaigns about, you know, how high the podiums are, let alone who the moderators are is pretty intense. again, thinking back to our experience, 2007, 2008. it was the top candidates, the clinton campaign and the obama campaign that came to us and asked us to sanction, to try to cut down on the number of debates because you can't stop it. >> the interesting thing about this. it is sort of symptomatic of the problems we're having with what we would call the msm. the main stream media. that is, there's not much going on in august and the media
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cannot stand to write substance stories themselves always like to write process stories. so this gets on television. this is a ridiculous thing to be talking about. it gets on television because it is cheaper and easier, you don't have to think much to talk about something some political guy said. whether it has any substance or not. that's what august is full of because there is nothing going on in congress. and usually nothing going on in congress any way. >> you cannot blame reince trying to make a little press. >> i don't blame the chairman. i do blame the reporters for taking it seriously. >> it will be interesting to see there's a little news that came out yesterday that apparently fox television production may partner with nbc. let's see if there is the same outreach at fofl. i want to get your take on something else. there is an online game that is going around right now called slap hillary. and let's take a look the. it encourages players to press a button and a hand will come out and slap a cartoon image of
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hillary clinton. you know, governor, it seems to me that if priebus had any -- priebus should be using whatever power or influence he has to talk about this and to say to people, regardless of whether or not you like hillary clinton, smacking women or promoting smacking women, particularly when you're trying to get women voters is not okay. >> the problem is he doesn't have any power. it is not that he doesn't have power over the gop. i think he is trying to run the party in a fairly reasonable way. there is a wing of this party that what i would call main stream republicans are terrified of. and it makes they will sound crazy. and yes, i can't imagine, i haven't seen the number on what women think of the republican party lately. but they worked so hard to alienate all the hispanics and they succeeded. now it looks like the war on women is real. this is really the war on women. not just the abortion stuff and the crazy stuff going on in texas and north carolina. the war on women is putting up
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probably the best known woman in the world and having a hand come out and slap her and having the republican party sponsor that. i would that be doing this if i were in his place. it is really stupid. you should be calling this out instead of encouraging it. >> i should clarify that it is a republican anlt hillary pac. but as the cheryl of the party it seems to me, if you're going to use what little bully pulpit you have to do something, rather than making these false, hollow threats, could you actually do some good and say, hey, violence against women is bad. >> he can help himself and the party here but he won't. they haven't been able to do it. the problem is the conservative pacs, the koch brothers and all those people, everybody is so beholden to them, they're terrified of them. until they stand up to them i don't think they'll win any republicans. >> thank you. next, detroit may be the
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canary in the coal mine but how can it be that banks are too big to fail but our cities are on their own. this is your first time missing a payment. and you've got the it card, so we won't hike up your apr for paying late. that's great! it is great! thank you. at discover, we treat you like you'd treat you. get the it card with late payment forgiveness. [ crashing ] [ male announcer ] when your favorite food starts a fight, fight back fast with tums. trusted heartburn relief that goes to work in seconds. nothing works faster. ♪ tum, tum tum tum tums!
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it would be foolish to ignore the fact that drove detroit to bankruptcy. and i believe that the detroit experience holds lessons for us and for every american city. cities across the country all face the prospect of pension costs swallowing more and more of their budget. and new york is no exception. >> we've heard this blame game time and again. for years now, the right wing has demonized america's labor unions by blaming public pensions and benefits for financial troubles at the state and local levels. despite the impact of issues ranging from politicians who make promises they cannot keep to the impact of the recession.
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>> union wages and benefits have reached the point where governments can't afford to operate. >> education, health care and others are diminished because so much money is being devoured by very high salaries. >> would you agree with me that this is sort of a kickback system, that they are rewarded with contracts that the public cannot afford. >> your tax dollars pay union salaries and union dues. in return for budget busting pensions and benefits, it busts right back to democrat campaigns. >> it is stealing from everything else. >> here are the facts on unions. they are destroying the countries, not just ours but all around the world with their out of control pensions. >> now, this is a problem many more cities are facing. 36 municipalities have filed for bankruptcy since 2010. and according to the pugh center on the states, it is estimated that states' pension plans across the country were underfunded by $1.4 trillion in
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2010. and nine states have set less than 60%. so here's the question with all this finger pointing. who will end up paying for this mess? will it be retirees who lose their benefits that they have worked for and earn? or taxpayers who will pay more to cover those shortfalls? joining me now, the senior fellow at the center for budget and policy priorities and bloomberg view columnist megan mccardle. thank you for joining me. so i want to start with you. and i want to sort out this anti-labor rhetoric from the fiscal reality of, we have cities that are making promises it can't keep. then they're blaming labor. there are annul of cities. >> there's a great deal of variation between the states and the cities. i was looking at some numbers before our segment here. the new york state teacher's if you said, they're unionized. that is funded at 90%.
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the city fund is funded at 60%. so you have one fund quite healthy in term of the assets to meet their liabilities and another fund that needs help. there is no getting away from the fact that lots of cities, lots of unions, lots of pensioners are going to have to get in there and figure out ways to make this equation work better. and in fact, 43 states have done precisely. that i think this is underreported. they've reduced their liabilities, increased their assets one way or the other. sometimes it means taking the haircuts that folks are talking about right now. so i think the important thing is to recognize the variation, recognize the way this can be fixed. and not to just go all hair on fire which is, you know, really just an attack on unions way too broadly. >> the thing is, as we heard in the clip. there are attacks about the massive pensions. in the case of detroit, we're talking about pensioners receive something like $19,000 a year.
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that's not exactly, you know, a golden parachute. >> exactly. the average pensioner in detroit gets about $1,600 a month. about $19,000 a year. and look, detroit is a great example of how this is a lot more complicated than the rhetoric you played at the beginning. detroit obviously has a declining tax base. detroit obviously has a huge industrial problem with its very narrow portfolio in auto manufacturers, as globalization took the city down while they really didn't diversify. detroit was borrowing to meet its operating costs. that's very different than most cities throughout the country. >> you made a really interesting point in the case of detroit. you pointed out in a piece in bloomberg, that they do have accountability for the decisions that elected politicians make themselves made promise thes could not keep but there is some
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accountability there. and you said yes, i know this was often bad politics. not sound public stewardship. we have to treat decisions made by elected officials as well. decisions made by the citizens of those locales. if the citizenry can demand to reegg in at any time, government can't function at all. not even the bits we like like police and roads. can you expand? >> i think when you look back at the history of city pensions, everyone has made mistakes. whatever you want to say. politicians have made promise that's they couldn't fulfill to get elected. and the unions in a lot of cases weren't being good stewards of their members' pensions in materials of saying, i want to make sure this is fully funded. that is a core job they have and a lot of them did not do a good job making sure these funds had the assets they were going to need. that can be part of collective bargaining themselves didn't exert the force they could have. instead, they sort of exerted
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maximum benefit which looked good when they went to their members. but they did not say, okay, maximum contributions now. i think that is something where everyone made a bunch of mistakes. the fact is that now these pensions were promised. people did work for years under the impression they would get them. and to the extent that it is possible, cities and states have a responsibility to make sure these funds are fully funded. the real tragedy is in cases like detroit where there isn't the money to do it even if we all agree they should. >> i would argue sometime in collective bargaining, you also hearing the other side sort of again, raising cain about what's being demanded about them. we're not talking about a lot of money. and i agree with you. there's at love mistakes that get made. there is a vicious cycle, right citizens are paying for mistakes that were previously made. retirees and logs benefits. one of the things we see is that as cities were trying to raise taxes, reduce services, to sort
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of pay off some of that. some of the service that's retirees will need, it can also impact the quality of life in that city as we saw in detroit. our banks are too big to fail. how is it that our cities are on their own? >> first, let's be very clear. you're right in your description of detroit but detroit is kind of one of a kind. it is actually a mistake. there are people who said that. none of them are on this panel. it is a mistake to say we're all greek -- we're all greece or we're all detroit. detroit with its declining tax base, that is really at the heart of many of the problems we're seeing here other cities don't quite face that. and there are bad actors but there are also good actors. it is clear that almost no pension plan is fully funded. almost no pension plan is fully funded. once you get on 80% or 90%,
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you're in very good shape. >> maybe that's what we need to change. >> i would point out that part of the reason you don't have overfunded pension funds is that government regulations discourage funds from having more than 80% or 90%. that's a real problem. you get years like 2007 or 1999 where you've got a big booming market. and then the irs says disgorge all these extra overfunding that you have. and then when the market crashes, as everyone knew it would, a lot of these ended up in problems. i agree with you that they don't all get there but it would be nice. >> doing close to 80. >> we're going to have to leave it there. >> thank you so much. imagine being a farmer. the water on your farm is flammable and your kids can't
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three years ago, i was a republican. now, i'm an independent. >> what they're doing here is the biggest assault on private property rights that i've ever heard or seen and they're supposed to be conservatives. that's one of the founding principles. >> that was from the new hbo movie, gasland two. the follow-up to the oscar nominated gasland which raises even more disturbing questions about big oil company versus farmers and property rights, access to clean water and accountability. why isn't a company accountable when it starts drilling near your property? and your top water starts turning flammable. when your farm's irrigation gets so contaminated that you have to buy bottled water for your chickens and livestock. or when you spend your life savings on a house.
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then watch its value drop to zero. for that matter, where is your right to free speech? gag orders have become rampant in lawsuits over hydro fracturing as the case of the family who had to leave tir home in mt. pleasant, california who had to leave after contamination after a settlement, the gag order even applied to their kids. these 7 and 10-year-old children are not supposed to talk about their childhood memories of burning eyes, sore throats, headaches, earaches or the gas drilling itself for the rest of their lives. joining me now, the director and producer of gasland and now gas land two. and deborah is co-managing attorney of the earth justice and filed a briefcase on behalf of doctors, scientists and researchers. i want to start with you. when i was, we are saying when i watched the film, i was just stunned by the lack of rights that people don't have.
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you think you have rights you and really don't. >> the new film is less about the air pollution but about the contamination of the government. one of the thing people can do is appeal to the state darrel of environmental protection or go as far as the epa. we found that they have so much influence on government that in fact, they've taken that democratic participation away from the people. >> you know, state representative from texas makes an interesting point. here necessary gas land two. let's take a listen. >> there is really absolutely nothing new about this. i mean, we've been doing resource extraction at the expense of the indigenous populations hire history of the country. kind of unique to the situation you is got a lot of upper middle class white people with college degrees getting ticked off because they're being treated the way third world people have always been treated by corporate america. >> so that's an interesting
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point. >> there is always been people who have been expendable in the face of wanting to get coal out from under mountains in appalachian or oil in nigeria. what we're seeing one to two million new wells around the united states. in 34 states, there massive drilling campaign is that arena is expanding to a lot of people that don't normally have that. this is what we're seeing. it is extreme energy we're already in a paradigm shift. tar sabds extraction which scrapes off huge forests in canada. deep water drilling. this is a new paradigm in energy development. much more toxic and destructive. it creates human rights violations. this is what we're seeing and that's what the new film explores. >> also, these companies are then not held accountability for whatever damage may be done. >> it is very hard to keep them
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accountable. when you see the civil suits, you mentioned that family which knew well. we were tracking this sxem interviewing them and then they dropped off the radar. about half the people cannot speak anymore because they entered into a settlement. those settlements have gag orders. that to me is a high school rights violation. when you force people to move and you take away their ability to tell their story, you're taking away two of the most fundamental thing about who they are. that's the story. >> so let's talk about the family. they cut the words into their lawn so people could see it. can you really have a gag order against children? >> well, i've never heard of one before. this industry is so arrogant that they expect to be able to tell people to do whatever the industry wants as a matter of fact they managed to persuade, shall we say, to release not only their own rights but those of their children. and one can understand under the circumstances why they did that.
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they were under extreme situation. they had serious health impacts. they had no way out. they're surrounded by the industry. the only way they can protect their children's future is giving up their right to speak. >> and they can then not warn their neighbors. you may know you have a contaminant but you can't tell your friends. >> that's right. that's why earth justice got involve in the case. there is so little information out there about the relationship between this industry and the health impacts because of the campaign of secrecy that this industry has been mounting. so we were in on behalf of health professionals who are very concerned that by using these kinds of gag orders, they were not going to be able to get the an he can colt information that they need on build on until we have more systemic research available. >> it's fascinating. watch the film. gas land two. you will learn a lot. thank you. that does it for me.
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